i have to conclude israel isn’t worth it

My comment to Gideon Levy’s “The Upgrade State”

Title: I have to conclude Israel isn’t worth it
Name: Rowan
City: London State: England
My first comment to this thread was rejected, and if I say why, this one will be too (*). I’ve tried to be nice to all factions in Israel, to see the idealism, however warped, in even the most right wing factions, to see the visionary and mystic qualities in settler theology, and so forth, but, when I listen to my favorite Israeli Jewish rock and punk bands, even with my distinctly limited comprehension of hebrew, I can’t help noticing that the majority of them wish zionism had never been born, and who am I to argue with them?

(*) I’ll tell you all approximately what it said : it said that although the Israelis had great charm, they were in some respects the victims of their own success, and this in ways that they were not yet ready to understand. Notably, I said, the process of denazification in Germany had over the decades developed into a new totalitarianism of its own, based on a false anthropology and a set of unconscious Jewish double standards, and this had spread to the USA, not just recently but as far back as the 1970s, and had been employed quite unjustly to provide cover for the US’s own totalitarian foreign policies. I gave the example of US Representative Steven Solarz, as far back as 1977, wantonly accusing such skeptics of US policy as Gareth Porter of being holocaust deniers. I then said that if this tendency was not halted it would lead to a global disaster in the near future—thinking, obviously, of McCain-Lieberman – RB)


  1. Xenophile
    Posted June 3, 2008 at 8:14 am | Permalink

    Rowan, could you elaborate on what do you mean by “false anthropology”?

  2. niqnaq
    Posted June 3, 2008 at 8:19 am | Permalink

    Yes. I am referring to the hegemonic theory in denazification and all of its spin-offs, to the effect that the Germans (and eventually, other nations, but not it seems Jews) have a ‘national character’ marked by authoritarianism, patriarchal attitudes, sado-masochistic fetishism, etc. One could refer to this type of thinking as ‘cod freudianism.’

    You might say that Freud himself is guilty of this, and I agree. Freud was among other things an enthusiastic member of B’nai B’rith, which is a Jewish separatist Masonic order, responsible for such abominations as the ADL. However, I want to hang on to the Freudian mechanics of the psyche, just as I would want to hang on to Einstein’s relativistic mechanics of the cosmos, irrespective of their politics, or philosophy, if you can call it that at all.

    I maintain that it is not fair to level this label at Marcuse and the original Frankfurt School, who I consider to have remained loyal to their marxian social values, but that it is fair to level it at Fromm and all the US sub-Frankfurters who followed him. I admit that Marcuse himself was in a complex and ambiguous position post-WW2, because he worked for US Intelligence during the war, and never as far as I know came clean about what this really meant.

    There is also a ‘cod existentialism,’ a la Victor Frankl. I have read that John McCain claims to be a Frankl fan (ha ha ha).

  3. Xenophile
    Posted June 3, 2008 at 8:57 am | Permalink

    Frankfurt schools is uncontrovertially a jewish movement, not only due the ethnic background of its protagonists, but due to their self-identification as Jews (see Adorno and Horckheimer, for instance). I tend to believe that the anti-assimilationist loathing of the “self-hating jew” has been converted into a method of producing “self-hating goyim”.

    The Frank. School’s explicit focus on cultural structures fitted perfectly with the post-WWII drive to denazify and re-educate the Germans. Even the terms used to define this are scarily totalitarian (People’s Pedagogy, People’s Education), and legitimized by the putative existence of a typically German “authoritarian personality”.

    I find it ironic that the only goy exponent of the Frankfurt School, Habermas, the inventor of the expression “Linksfaschismus” (Left fascism), may have had so many personal friction with the majority in the movement; he had his PhD thesis rejected by Adorno, forcing him to defend it in another university.

  4. niqnaq
    Posted June 3, 2008 at 8:58 am | Permalink

    The fact that something is “jewish” doesn’t necessarily prove anything one way or the other, unless you are a racist.

  5. Xenophile
    Posted June 3, 2008 at 9:13 am | Permalink

    You are correct. I was referring to the “self-hating jew” as a jewish meme, a cultural trait that is recurrent, specially after WWII. I did not say that racial resentment, and a desire to take revenge were their motivation. I see that being jewish possibly played a role in inspiring what you called a false anthropology that, due to unconscious jewish double standards, would not apply to jews. I am actually agreeing with you.

    On the other hand, it is silly to deny that jewish anti-assimilationism has a large dosis of cultural and even biological racism. Unless somebody takes an explicit stance, and this hardly ever happens among jews, I simply cannot tell when non-assimilationism is biological racism, tribalism or national chauvinism.

  6. niqnaq
    Posted June 3, 2008 at 9:23 am | Permalink

    since we agree, then, perhaps you can help me get a job, or a research grant, or something – my govt is still nagging me to do this, and besides, I need a better standard of living than I am getting from “jobseeker’s allowance”.

    I still have that Soros application outstanding, awaiting three respectable sponsors (not necessarily academics).

    My desire to do a sympathetic study of young Israeli Jews still exists, though whether I would be allowed into the country I rather wonder.

  7. Xenophile
    Posted June 3, 2008 at 9:33 am | Permalink

    Rowan, I will keep this in mind. I have left the insalubrious milieu of academia and international organizations for some time already, so I cannot see, from where I stand, any job that fits your interests. I will however look into commercial copywritting in English, and if something shows up, I’ll let you know. Best of luck in your search.

  8. niqnaq
    Posted June 3, 2008 at 9:48 am | Permalink

    Thanks—I generally have no idea who anybody who reads me may be, and I try to assume that not all of you are ‘drop-outs and wasters,’ to borrow a phrase from my own article on the OTO.

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