look at these wonderful ‘ceasefire lines’ and tell me how each side can withdraw 15 km at all points

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Buffer zone agreed on in Ukrainian peace talks
Yuras Karmanau, AP, Sep 19 2014

de8d76d12e5b4058befb3d74c3666b60-de8d76d12e5b4058befb3d74c3666b60-0Russian Ambassador to Ukraine Mikhail Zurabov, former Ukrainian President Leonid Kuchma and OSCE envoy Heidi Tagliavini. Photo: Sergei Grits/AP

MINSK, Belarus — Participants in Ukrainian peace talks agreed early Saturday to create a buffer zone to separate government troops and pro-Russian militants and withdraw foreign fighters and heavy weapons from the area of conflict in eastern Ukraine. The deal reached by representatives of Ukraine, Russia, the Moscow-backed rebels and the OSCE marked an effort to add substance to a ceasefire agreement that was signed on Sep 5 but has been frequently broken by clashes. The new deal signed after hours of talks that dragged late into the night envisages setting up a buffer zone that would be 30 km wide. They said after the talks that dragged into the night and ended early Saturday in the Belarusian capital Minsk that all heavy weapons should be withdrawn from that zone. The negotiators also reached agreement on the withdrawal of all foreign fighters and mercenaries, a diplomatic reference to Russians fighting alongside the rebels. Ukraine and the West have accused Russia of fueling the insurgency in the mostly Russian-speaking Donetsk and Luhansk provinces in eastern Ukraine with weapons and soldiers. Moscow has denied that, saying that Russians who joined the mutiny did so as private citizens. Pressed to comment about the agreement on the withdrawal of foreign fighters, Russian Ambassador to Ukraine, Mikhail Zurabov, who represented Moscow in the talks, said:

Those whom we call mercenaries are present on both sides.

He said that the OSCE should control the pullout of foreign fighters. Heidi Tagliavini, an OSCE envoy at the talks, said that the group’s monitors will be deployed to the buffer zone to monitor the deal. The negotiators have left aside the most controversial issue: the future status of the rebel regions. The Ukrainian parliament this week passed a law giving a broad autonomy to the areas controlled by the rebels, including the power to hold local elections and form their own police force. Alexander Zakharchenko, the leader of rebels in Donetsk, said that Ukraine and the rebels have various interpretation of the law and the talks should continue. In Donetsk, the largest rebel-held city in east Ukraine, the separatists held a city-wide cleanup day Friday, sending prisoners out to help remove the debris that has piled up after months of shelling. Throughout the cease-fire, periods of peace have been interrupted by intermittent gunfire. The same was true Friday, when the Donetsk city council said in a statement that one person was killed by shelling during the night. Col Andrei Lysenko, a spokesman for the National Security and Defense Council, told journalists in Kiev that two servicemen were killed in the past day during the fighting. The streets were quiet Friday as the rebels called for a cleanup. In one school that was shelled in late August, four Ukrainian prisoners guarded by armed rebels were sweeping up debris.

Strelkov on the Minsk Memorandum 2.0
Colonel Cassad, Sep 20 2014 10:39

In fact, come true, “what has long been talked about by the Bolsheviks.” Ukri overcame panic, reformed, prepared for new fights and clearly demonstrate that they agree on only one scenario: the complete capitulation of Russia regarding Novorossia. “Brilliant success of the peacekeepers,” grouping Surkov-Lavrov-Zurabov again bring the President to the same choice that was a month ago: either decisive war (now with even greater losses and expenses), or shameful capitulation (hereinafter, the Crimea and the “Milosevich script.”) For the sake of it and stopped fighting. It remains only to ask the question: how long will Surkov be able to blatantly deceive Putin, passing off their “virtual success” as real achievements? (oh, come on, this is a ridiculous myth, that Surkov is hoodwinking Putin. You think Putin is deaf, blind and stupid? – RB) ? And how long the President is confident in Surkov and to remain under his control? In his time the deposed Napoleon said at St Helena (close to the text): “if I had hung Talleyrand and Fouché, I would now ruled France!” And this was a great statesman, who was also confident that easily “beat” mischief in their environment. Who says that “everything is bad”? It will be bad only if the President will make a suicidal step, accepting the conditions of the party of treason as “the only solution.” And the last steps and rhetoric any rag-tag (starting from the buffoon of irica) suggests that it isn’t going to be possible to surrender Novorossia. The only bad thing is that the new policy still trying to hold the “old hands,” that is, through people who have already demonstrated their incompatibility with it. Accordingly, the results are no good, and instead of brilliant success, continuous losses and ridiculous antics around a variety of “open secrets” (which the whole world knows, but the immediate actors evidently do not).

Minsk Memorandum 2.0
Colonel Cassad, Sep 20 2014 08:55

kiev1

In Minsk signed another Memorandum on Ukraine. It remains unclear who Kuchma represents; he obviously acts as a diplomatic cutout. Contents of the Minsk Memorandum:

  1. Termination of the use of weapons is considered to be common.
  2. Stop military units and formations of the parties on the line of contact as at Sep 19.
  3. Ban on use of all types of weapons and the conduct of offensive operations.
  4. Within days of the adoption of this Memorandum allotment weapons with a caliber of more than 100 mm from the contact line at a distance of not less than 15 km on each side, including settlements, which gives the opportunity to create a zone of termination of the use of weapons of a width not less than 30 km of the security zone. To take on the line of contact of the sides of the artillery system caliber of more than 100 mm to remove their maximum range.
  5. The ban on the deployment of heavy weapons and heavy equipment in the area limited settlements (settlements identified in the text of the document, but Kuchma did not name them).
  6. Ban on the installation of new mine-explosive engineering obstacles at the border of the security zone, obligations on termination of a previously installed mine barriers in the security zone.
  7. The ban since the adoption of this Memorandum of flying combat aircraft and foreign aircraft except apparatus of the OSCE over the security zone.
  8. Deployment in the area of termination of the use of weapons monitoring mission of the OSCE in the group of observers from the organization within days of the adoption of this Memorandum. This area can be divided into sectors, the number of edges which agree in preparation for the work of the monitoring group of the OSCE observation mission.
  9. The withdrawal of all foreign armed forces, military equipment, as well as militants and mercenaries from the territory of Ukraine to the OSCE monitoring.

It is not difficult to notice the continuing persistent attempts of Russia to freeze the conflict and will shy away from direct confrontation with the West, amid all of new sanctions and those explicit threats from the West sound. Since the question of the status of DND and LNR at the meeting were not discussed, the diplomatic line of contact gradually leads to the creation of the first sort site of uncertain status, the fate of which will continue trading. In more detail, in the evening.

The Ukrainian authorities and militias agreed on nine parameters truce
RIA Novosti, Sep 20 2014 04:38

MINSK – Kiev authorities and Eastern militias have agreed on a general ceasefire, the creation of a security zone on the current line of contact, withdrawal of heavy weapons from this zone and settlements and deploy a monitoring mission of the OSCE. The parties are in Minsk talks brokered by Russia and the OSCE.On Sep 5, the parties agreed to a truce and a series of questions about the status of the region (Minsk Protocol), and on Sep 19 was developed to implement the Memorandum of nine points. The text of the Memorandum was read after negotiations, the Ukrainian representative, the second President Leonid Kuchma. Contents of the Minsk Memorandum (as above – RB):

  1. Termination of the use of weapons is considered to be common.
  2. Stop military units and formations of the parties on the line of contact as at Sep 19.
  3. Ban on use of all types of weapons and the conduct of offensive operations.
  4. Within days of the adoption of this Memorandum allotment weapons with a caliber of more than 100 mm from the contact line at a distance of not less than 15 km on each side, including settlements, which gives the opportunity to create a zone of termination of the use of weapons of a width not less than 30 km of the security zone. To take on the line of contact of the sides of the artillery system caliber of more than 100 mm to remove their maximum range.
  5. The ban on the deployment of heavy weapons and heavy equipment in the area limited settlements (settlements identified in the text of the document, but Kuchma did not name them).
  6. Ban on the installation of new mine-explosive engineering obstacles at the border of the security zone, obligations on termination of a previously installed mine barriers in the security zone.
  7. The ban since the adoption of this Memorandum of flying combat aircraft and foreign aircraft except apparatus of the OSCE over the security zone.
  8. Deployment in the area of termination of the use of weapons monitoring mission of the OSCE in the group of observers from the organization within days of the adoption of this Memorandum. This area can be divided into sectors, the number of edges which agree in preparation for the work of the monitoring group of the OSCE observation mission.
  9. The withdrawal of all foreign armed forces, military equipment, as well as militants and mercenaries from the territory of Ukraine to the OSCE monitoring.

Minsk Protocol
Signed Sep 5, Minsk Protocol was broader in scope: in addition to statements about the truce he assumed the exchange of prisoners and a number of political arrangements, in particular the commitment of Ukraine to adopt the law on the special status of some areas of Donbass. The parameters of the truce were not marked. The agreement contains an agreement to provide immediate bilateral cessation of the use of weapons (1), to ensure the supervision of the OSCE over the observance of the armistice (2), and the Russian-Ukrainian border (4). Kuchma at the end of the Minsk negotiations: the parties will continue the exchange of prisoners. It is assumed immediate release of all hostages and illegally detained persons (5), the output of “illegal armed formations, military equipment, as well as militants and mercenaries from the territory of Ukraine” (10) and the adoption of the law on the inadmissibility of the prosecution and punishment of persons in connection with the events in the East of the country (6). The document envisages the launch of the national dialogue (7), decentralization of power, including the adoption in Ukraine of the law on the special status of certain regions of Donetsk and Lugansk regions (3), and in the Donbass early local elections (9). The parties also agreed to take the necessary measures to improve the humanitarian situation in the Donbass (8) and to adopt a program of economic revival of the region (11). Last, the Protocol gives participants a security guarantee (12).

The law on the special status
The Ukrainian Parliament on Sep 16 adopted the law on the special status of some areas of Donbass, which assumes that local authorities will be able to negotiate with the Central government agreements on economic, social and cultural development, the heads of the Prosecutor’s office and courts be appointed taking into account the opinion of local authorities, creates a voluntary national police, are guaranteed the freedom to use any language and encouraged cross-border cooperation with Russia. In addition, there will be introduced a special economic regime, aimed at restoring the industry, infrastructure and housing, attracting investment and creating new jobs. The Cabinet ordered to take the target state program for development of areas with special status, the fiscal costs of their support cannot be reduced even in the case of sequestration. It is supposed to be here on Dec 7 election of deputies and heads of municipalities whose powers cannot be stopped prematurely. In addition, declared amnesty to the participants of the events on the territory of Donetsk and Lugansk regions”. The law will be valid for three years, but the Advisor of the President of Ukraine Igor Grynov said that it may be cancelled within six months “if a clean bill of health.”

8 Comments

  1. Posted September 20, 2014 at 10:59 am | Permalink

    “Surkov be able to blatantly deceive Putin, passing off their “virtual success” as real achievements? (oh, come on, this is a ridiculous myth, that Surkov is hoodwinking Putin. You think Putin is deaf, blind and stupid? – RB) ?”

    Dont think he ment it was that obvious (noone thinks Putin is completly dumb).
    So most likely he was refering more to Surkov etc deceiving by argumenting for something that in the long run is not in Russias interest. (Portraying a sollution, as something else then it is).

    Cow-dirt is still cow-dirt, even if you put a blanket of silk over it and take a picture of how lovely it looks.

  2. niqnaq
    Posted September 20, 2014 at 11:02 am | Permalink

    RRA, this whole morning I have been copying things in Yandexian which I know what they mean but no one else does, like this:

    “Old bike about evil marmot related and the good Pole. Such an innocent and kind and unsuspecting, Polo. Such statements and their September briefing Shooters made himself a clown.”

    So I should be giving the original russian, and let someone translate better. But is too much like hard work opening extra tabs.

    🙂

  3. Posted September 20, 2014 at 11:23 am | Permalink

    I guess the only important essence of this “end of war”-agreement is:
    Serious treason, and the end of novorossia.
    And the end for the east-ujranians only chance of freedome.

    Uf they surrender weapons now:
    1. Ukr coup gov, will get alot of uparming (by nato countries) in the next months.
    2. Ukr coup gov will have time to train their army.
    3. Ukr coup gov will get ALOT more soldiers.

    Vs

    4. Naf will start from scratch. (Its hard enough to capture enemy vehicles, artillery, etc). But that was done when the ukr army was very inexperienced, uncoordinated, etc etc.
    But in a years time when the ukr army is much bigger, much more trained, more coordinated… It will get alot harder to get the necessary weapons. And atleast fast enough to even be able to not be completly overrun at day1.

    Basicly a Royal screwjob.

    The Only hope after this, is if the neo-nazis in the west-ukraine do a new coup against the oligarchs.

    But the neo-nazis do not stand a chance alone.
    (Maybe if the neo-nazis start, and then the east-ukranians “join” in their struggle).

    So the nasty oligarch scums in ukraine seems to have won with their coup.
    And usa won. They pulled of the nose-punch against russia.

    And tested the russian-bear. The bear was made of plastic.
    2015: next project can go into activemode: Azerbadsjan-Armenia war, Kurdistan independent, Syria-war, and Kurdistan->Turkey->Europe gaspipes. (And eventually Azerbadsjan->Turkey->Europe gaspipes).

  4. niqnaq
    Posted September 20, 2014 at 11:42 am | Permalink

    Agreed. I could use a word which, you know, would lose me all my wonderful new female friends. More important I should live what’s left of my own life, than throw it away in futile anger on the part of the people of Donbass whom I’ve never even met, intriguing though they are. So I won’t use the word. OK.

    😎

  5. Posted September 20, 2014 at 1:06 pm | Permalink

    “In a joint session in Donetsk, almost unanimously, the People’s Deputies of the Supreme Soviets of the DNR and LNR found the provisions of the memorandum signed in Minsk on the night of 20 September unacceptable. The DNR Supreme Soviet is preparing for an extraordinary session on Sunday, to prepare counterproposals calling for the complete withdrawal of junta troops from the Donbass.

    http://02varvara.wordpress.com/

    A shred of hope? Or just more fog or temporary stalling before politics hammers the “agreement” through anyway?.

  6. Posted September 20, 2014 at 1:08 pm | Permalink

    Btw Slayangard has posted a new english version of the map (litle has changed), but it is in english:

    (Unsure if you have allready posted it).

  7. niqnaq
    Posted September 20, 2014 at 1:09 pm | Permalink

    Ha! You know, I’ve given Col Cassad such a hammering today that now:

    LiveJournal Outage. Unplanned outage. Sorry, we are experiencing technical difficulties and we are working on the issue. We will restore service as soon as possible. Please also check the status of at Livejournal http://status.livejournal.com. We will attempt to connect you in 30 seconds. We have problems, and we know about them. Specialists LiveJournal aware that some users may experience difficulties with access to the pages of the service. System administrators LiveJournal are working to solve the problems. We will try to keep you informed about any changes in the status page: http://status.livejournal.com you will be redirected to a website in 30 seconds. Thank you for your patience and understanding!

  8. niqnaq
    Posted September 20, 2014 at 1:11 pm | Permalink

    That Hartin map is derived from Dragon_First of the previous day, but even in terms of situation previous day, it shows Donetsk airport without even a bubble, inside Novo territory, which is just plain wrong. It never was.

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